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eswube
Post subject: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: August 20th, 2013, 12:52 pm
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Although of all ships of the Polish Navy that took part in the World War 2 it's the destroyers and submarines that are remembered best, they weren't only combat vessels of that service.

Although majority of the Polish fleet was destroyed during the German invasion of 1939, three destroyers and two submarines made it to Great Britain, forming the nucleus of Polish Naval Detachment in Great Britain, itself a part of Polish Armed Forces in Exile.

Submarine Chasers

When the French-German armistice of 1940 was signed, around 100 French ships were present in the British ports (including 2 battleships, 4 destroyers, 7 submarines, 6 large torpedo boats and number of minesweepers and smaller units with 15000 personnel). Majority of their crews (around 14500) were unwilling to join general de Gaulle's Free French and were eventually repatriated to Vichy France, but British authorities were obviously unwilling to let them take their ships with them. Eventually some of these vessels were temporarily transferred to Polish Navy (Polish Naval Detachment) which in turn had more available personnel than ships. Initially there were plans to commission battleship Paris, but they were quite quickly dropped when it was realized that this ship was in poor shape and of minimal utility (except for some propaganda value as "Poland's first battleship"), but would put a great strain on Polish resources. Ultimately largest French vessel in Polish custody was destroyer Ouragan (H16) used between july 1940 and april 1941, but Polish Navy also used a group of smaller vessels.

Most combat capable of these were two submarine chasers (Chasseur Sous-Marins) of the Ch-5 class - Ch-11 and Ch-15 (in British records also described as Q-011 and Q-015). They were taken over by the Polish Navy on 19 july 1940, without change of name and without ORP prefixes (Okręt Rzeczypospolitej Polskiej - (War)Ship of the Republic of Poland, but with OF (Okręt Francuski - French (War)Ship) instead. Also, they carried double flags: French and Polish at the same time. They remained in Polish service until 5 february 1941 (Ch-11 made 46 patrols, Ch-15 38 made patrols), when they were returned to Free French.
It should be noted, that some German and French publications claim that Polish Navy used chasers Ch-6 and Ch-7 which were sunk by German S-boot's on 11 october 1940, but that's completely false information.

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Motor Gun Boats and Motor Torpedo Boats

Before the war, Polish Navy ordered 2 motor torpedo boats in the Samuel White shipyard at Cowes. Built ships differed significantly from the initial design ( http://www.shipbucket.com/forums/viewto ... 225#p99225 ) - partially due to design refinements already made before the war, partially due to war itself. Eventually ships were requisitioned by the Royal Navy and finished as gun boats - initially classified as MA/SB-47 and -48 (Motor Anti Submarine Boat), later renamed MGB-47 and -48 (Motor Gun Boat). Subsequently, MGB-47 was commissioned into Royal Navy and used as training craft at HMS St. Christopher (Fort William, Scotland) until 1944 (when it was decommissioned). MGB-48, however, was transferred back to Polish custody and commissioned into Polish Navy as S-1 (name planned from the beginning) in september 1940. First months of it's existence were very troubled: it was launched with month delay, during trials faulty fuel installation literally flooded the internal compartments, forcing it's total replacing. When repaied ship began trials again, large fire burst out, forcing the crew to abandon the ship (eventually fire died by itself) and S-1 had to be rebuilt. Finally it entered service on 31 january 1941 at the 3rd MGB Flotilla at Fowey. After several busy months, ship was sent to refit due to continuing problems with fuel installation. Also, the italian Isotta-Fraschini engines were replaced with Packard ones. Later it continued it's service in the La Manche channel (interrupted with another fire, probably in april 1943 and refit). On 21 february 1944 it was placed in reserve due to being very worn-out and finally scrapped in 1947.
Armament:
initially - 1 x 20mm Oerlikon, 2 x I x 0.5in Vickers, 12 depth charges;
later (as on drawing) - 1 x 20mm Oerlikon, 2 x II x 0.5in Vickers, 2 x II x 0.303 Lewis, 4 depth charges.

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In return for MGB-47, Polish Navy received two smaller MGB's, of the British Power Boat's 63 ft type. They were British MA/SB-44 (MGB-44) and MA/SB-45 (MGB-45), in Polish service renamed S-2 and S-3 respectively. They began their service under Polish flag in july 1940 and in august they become part of 3rd MGB Flotilla at Fowey (later at Dover). S-3 was considered a jinxed ship: in september 1940 it ran aground at Goodwin Sands, in october it was heavily damaged by magnetic mine. It's refit lasted until june 1941, only to ran aground (suffering heavy damage to the bow) days later. In january 1942 it suffered damage from it's own depth charges and eventually was decommissioned for technical reasons already on 16 may 1943. On the other hand, S-2 had very successful career: already in august 1940 it shot down He-111 bomber (during air raid on Portsmouth) and in june 1942 it become famous after it single-handedly attacked and forced to retreat 6 German S-boots. It was finally decommissioned in july 1944.
Armament:
initially (as on drawing) - 1 x 20mm Oerlikon, 2 x II x 0.303 Lewis, 4-10 depth charges;
later - 1 x 20mm Oerlikon, 2 x II x 0.5in Vickers, 2 x I x 0.303 Lewis, up to 18 mines of 30kg.
Note: I had to use non-standard 20mm Oerlikon, since the one on parts sheet was impossible to squeeze in place

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As a replacement for S-3, Polish Navy received another MGB from British Power Boats, but of 72ft (71,6ft) design. The boat (initially British MGB-113) was named S-4 and entered service under Polish flag on 5 july 1943, joining 9th MGB Flotilla at Dover. In late 1943 all British chasers were apparently renamed MTB's, regardless of actual armament. British name of S-4 changed to MTB-432, and it's parent unit to 2nd MTB Flotilla. In early 1944 S-4 suffered light damage after running aground and was sent for refit. There it was decommissioned from Polish Navy when whole flotilla was transferred under Dutch control on 18 april 1944.
Armament: 1 x 40mm Pom-Pom, 1 x II x 20mm Oerlikon, 2 x II x 0.303 Lewis (?), 2 depth charges.
It should be noted, that due to certain discrepancies in British records, for a long time it was uncertain wether S-4 was BPB 72ft boat or Vosper's design, but nowadays sources seem to agree that it was BPB.

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Since the MGB/MTB's used by the Polish Navy in early 1944 were already severely worn-out, it was eventually decided to replace them all by modern MTB's of White 73ft design. Apparently only 6 such boats were built as MTB-424 to MTB-429 and all were commissioned into Polish Navy as S-5 (3 may 1944), S-6 (10 july), S-7 (30 july), S-8 (19 september), S-9 (26 october) and S-10 (31 october), all serving in 8th MTB Flotilla in Dover. Their operational service was quite short: large Sterling Admiral engines and heavy 57mm gun on bow put great strain on hulls which developed structural cracks and deformations in propeller shafts. It was decided to remove torpedo tubes and strenghten hulls, but although boats were directed to shipyards for conversions, because nearing end of war no actual works were made and whole group remained idle for the rest of hostilities. Eventually boats returned to Royal Navy in october 1945 and shortly after all were sold into civilian hands. Apparently former S-8 was still used as accomodation barge as late as 1987.
Armament: 1 x 57mm 6-pounder, 1 x 20mm Oerlikon, 2 x II x 0.303 Lewis, 2 457mm torpedo launchers.

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On a note: many publications mention additional names of these boats: S-1 was supposed to be named Chart (Greyhound), S-2 - Wilczur (German Shepherd). S-3 - Wyżeł (Pointer) but these names aren't mentioned in any official documents, and crew members of these ships deny using them.

Auxiliary Patrol Vessels

Besides the purpose-built combat vessels, Polish Navy in Great Britain used also some auxiliary patrol vessels adapted from civilian ships.
Largest two of these were Médoc (P24) and Pomerol (P25) - two freighters of Worms et Compagnie, requisitioned in 1939 and adapted to role of aviso's with addition of four 100mm and two 37mm guns (and apparently four machine guns, although it's unclear where they were located). Like Ch-11 and Ch-15 they were taken over by Royal Navy after fall of France and on 18 july 1940 transferred to Polish Navy (with OF prefixes and double flags). They remained in Polish service until 21 october 1940, but some Polish crewmembers, including captains, remained. From that point these ships carried triple flags (!): French, British and Polish. Unfortunately, Médoc was sunk by Luftwaffe on 26 november 1940 (half of the crew perished, including 3 Poles with ship's captain kmdr por. Roman Stankiewicz). Polish crewmembers remained on Pomerol until 8 january 1941. After the war ship returned to it's initial owner.

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Additionaly, in 1940 Polish Navy temporarily used dozen of French, Belgian and Dutch armed fishing cutters, used as auxiliary patrol craft during period when German invasion seemed imminent. These were craft of various types and sizes, in Polish service named P-1 to P-12:
P-1 (O-54), ex-Renaissance, built in 1914, 104 BRT, armed with 1 Hotchkiss gun, 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-2 (O-173), ex-Oscar Auguste, built in 1930, 73 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-3 (O-336), ex-Elizabeth Guilbert, built in 1929, 67 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-4 (O-63), ex-St. Pierre, built in 1937, 23 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-5 (O-327), ex-Hendrik Conscience, built 1916, 252 BRT, armed with 1 Hotchkiss gun, 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-6 (B-2), ex-Sirius, built 1931, 90 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-7 (O-310), ex-Zee-Meeuw, built 1930, 100 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-8 (B-15), ex-De Drie Gezusters, built 1939, 49 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-9 (Z-15), ex-Blanche Marguerite, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-10 (O-335), ex-Charles Jeannine, built 1931, 83 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-11 (O-276), ex-Lucienne Christian, built 1930, 67 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines;
P-12 (O-208), ex-Femina (Ons Welzijn?), built 1930, 73 BRT, armed with 2 machine guns and 6 mines.
They were taken over by Polish Navy between 21 and 28 june 1940, and formed "Trawler Group" with three sections (headed by captains of P-1, P-5 and P-9), operating from Dartmouth. They were handed back to Royal Navy between 16 october and 4 november 1940. Unfortunately data regarding their appearance is sketchy at best (and often practically non-existent) therefore I couldn't do any drawings.


Last edited by eswube on January 11th, 2015, 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Thiel
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: August 20th, 2013, 3:30 pm
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May I suggest you use the Oerlikon from the US parts sheet? The one on the British sheet is at least twice as big as it's supposed to be. There might be some minor differences in the mounts and shields, but the gun itself should be exactly the same.

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Rhade
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: August 21st, 2013, 7:08 am
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To quality, as always.

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eswube
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: August 21st, 2013, 7:35 am
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Thanks for the advice Thiel! :)
It's updated now.


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Hood
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: August 21st, 2013, 8:33 am
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Excellent work.
The new Oerlikon will be on the new RN parts sheet fairly soon.

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bezdzik
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: April 18th, 2017, 2:11 pm
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Very nice! I need some drawings in better quality. Do you have such? What was the base for your drawings: photos, blueprints?


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superboy
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: April 18th, 2017, 3:06 pm
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Very nice work ! ;)


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Colosseum
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: April 18th, 2017, 4:28 pm
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Another four year thread bump from a new user with one post. Excellent. ;)

Might I suggest, guys, that we use PMs instead of necroposting old threads in the future? I'm amazed that we seem to consistently have this problem

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eswube
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: April 18th, 2017, 8:33 pm
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Since it has already been necroposted... :roll:

I don't remember all my sources after almost four years. Certainly among them - esp. for Medoc, Ch-11 and S-1 were "Wielkie dni małej floty" by Jerzy Pertek. I can recollect that British chasers were based on some Osprey publication.

But DO NOT reply, please.


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ALVAMA
Post subject: Re: Polish Coastal Combatants of World War 2Posted: April 20th, 2017, 7:52 pm
Excellent work! I love esp. the Auxiliary Patrol Vessel!


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