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NATO ASW Design Challenge http://www.shipbucket.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=2806 |
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Author: | acelanceloet [ March 12th, 2012, 10:53 pm ] | |||||||||||
Post subject: | NATO ASW Design Challenge | |||||||||||
Read the last post in the thread everyone. -TimothyC Every now and then, the idea of an Shipbucket design competition comes up on the forum. After the success of the 1936 gunboat thread some time ago, Thiel and I discussed if something like that could be set up again. After a long discussion, we decided just to do it. We have lots of own design AA boats and battleships on the bucket. So we de decided against something like that. We wanted something that could be drawn by both shipbucket masters and newbe’s. for the best it is test of their minds, for the newbe’s it is an perfect way to improve their way of thinking. We hope to see a lot of both joining in, just to see what different minds and experiences can come up with. We tried to emulate the real shipbuilding industry a bit by setting an set of specifications, but still leaving you guys free to do what you want as long as it stays inside these specs. The idea is an ASW/ASuW vessel from about 1980. About everything from a VDS tug to an Iroqouis is acceptable. The ships are restricted to real life or close to real life weapons (so the mad part of never build is not allowed ) Further specifications below: Country: NATO member In commision: 1975-1985 Displacement: 3000-5500 metric tons full load Speed: Sustained: 20kts, Sprint 30kts Range: Designers choice Primary mission: Anti Submarine Warfare Secondary missions: Self defence AAW, ASuW Aviation facilities: Designers choice Armament: Designers Choice Also, everybody with an opinion on one of the designs, feel free to comment. I will put the designs in the first post to compare all designs. If somebody comments on all designs posted, I might include their comments with the comparision as well. - Note for the ones who post an design: please post an shortlist of the capabilities, (speed, range,etc) specifications (length, beam, breadth, displacement, (if possible block coefficient) weapons, engine systems) so people like me, who like to calculate a bit, can try out things a bit. Of course none of all these are mandatory, don’t let this stop you from participating, but if you can… please do. list of finished designs:
NATO ASW proposal L:148m B:16.6M D:6.4M Wt: 5,500T Speed Cruise 18 Kts Sprint 30 Kts Range: 17,600 Km Propulsion: COGOG 2x Rolls-Royce Olympus TM3B 2x Rolls-Royce Tyne RM1C Armament: 1x 127mm/54 Compact Oto-melara 4x Single 20mm Oerlikon 2x Twin 30mm BMARC GCMAO3 1x Signaal 30mm SGE-30 Goalkeeper 4x Mk32 Mod3 Torpedo tubes Mk141 RGM84 Harpoon Mk29 Sea Sparrow Radar: Signaal LW08 Signaal ZW06 Signaal STIR Signaal WM22 Sonar: Type 2008 Type 2031Z Towed array Electronics: ESSM, ECM, Chaff, Communications and navagation. Complement: 225-250 Aircraft: 1 Sea Seaking HAS or 2x Lynx HAS Designed by a consortium of Dutch, Canadian and UK companies taking on lessons learnt from operations in Persian Gulf and with the British in the Falklands. The ship design included enhanced damage control and firefighting capabilities. Is well protected for operations in NBC enviroment. Extensive use is being made of automation. The Ship is designed to operate for Prolonged periods in GIUK gap and in Canada Greenland sealanes. But also has enhanced airconditioning to allow prolonged operation in Hot enviroments like Carribbean and Persian Gulf.
Type: ASW with ASuW and AAW capability's
Displacement: Approx. 5,000 tons Length: 396 feet (120.7 meters) Beam: 52 feet (16 meters) Drought: max: 22 feet (6.7 meters) Propulsion: 2-shaft COGOG 2 Rolls-Royce Olympus TM3B high-speed gas turbines (54,000 shp / 40 MW) 2 Rolls-Royce Tyne RM1C cruise gas turbines (9,700 shp / 7.2 MW) Speed: 31 knots+- 19 knots Range: 6,000 nmi (11,000 km) at 19 kn; 3,300 nmi (6,100 km) at 31 kn Complement: 140-280 Armament: Capability to be equipped with most American and European weapon systems. see drawings bellow. the standard weapon on them all is 1 * 76mm gun DP 2 * 30mm 2 * 12,7mm 2 * triple torpedo tubes 1 * quad sea sparrow launcher (with reload magazine Oslo class style). Armor: limited Kevlar splinter protection in critical areas Aircraft carried: 1+1 × Lynx, depends of mission The standard with Mk-141 Harpoon on foredeck: Here with Terne III (Rocket powered depth charges, with space for reload magazine): ASROC instead for Terne III:
A British armed frigate, around 5000t to 6000t.
Armament is 1 4.5" Mk.8 gun 1 Sea Wolf launcher 1 Ikara launcher 2 triple 12.75" ASW torpedoes 2 Wessex or Sea King helos Speed is 25kts sustained with CODAD engines
Vampire Class Frigate FF-07 Vampire FF-08 Voyager FF-09 Vengeance FF-10 Vendetta Length: 132m overall Beam: 14.2m Draught: 5.8m (over sonar dome) Displacement: 4,600t Machinery: CODLAG 4 x Paxman Valenta Diesel Generators 2 x Electric Motors 2 x Rolls-Royce Olympus Gas Turbines (48 MW/50,000 shp) Speed: 30kn Range: 4,500nm at 20kn Complement: 233 Aircraft: 2 x Westland Lynx 1 x 5"/54 caliber Mark 45 Mod 1 Gun 1 x Mk 29 GMLS 2 x Mk 141 quad GMLS 2 x Mk 32 SVTT 1 x 20mm Phalanx Block 0 CIWS 2 x 20mm GAM BO1 Guns 4 x 12.7mm M2HB HMGs AN/SPS-49 2D Air Search AN/SPS-55 Surface Search WM25 Fire Control System Mulloka Hull Sonar Type 2031 Towed Array Sonar AN/SLQ-32(V)2 EWS Mark 36 SRBOC AN/SLQ-25 Nixie Towed Torpedo Decoy
Type 25 or Chatham Class Frigate
Displacement: 3,500 tons standard, 4,100 tons fully loaded Dimensions: 412 feet long, beam 48ft 6ins, draught 19 ft (over sonar dome) Gun Armament: Two 20mm Oerlikon L/75AA in GAM-BO1 single mountings Missile Armament: Three sextuple BAe Sea Wolf launchers (45 missiles) and two qaudruple Harpoon launchers (8 missiles) Torpedo Armament: Two triple 12.75in A/S STWS-2 torpedo tube mountings (18 Stingray or Mk 46 A/S torpedoes) Aircraft: One EH101 or Lynx HAS. Mk.2/3 in a hangar aft (Skua ASMs and Stingray A/S torpedoes) Electronics: One Type 967/968 air/surface search radar, one Type 1006 navigation radar, two Type 911 fire-control radars used in conjuction with two GWS 25 Mod 3 SAM fire-control systems, one Sea Archer gun-fire control system, two chaff launchers, four Sea Gnat decoy launchers, one Type 2031 passive towed sonar array, one Type 2050 bow active/passive search and attack sonar, one Type 182 towed torpedo decoy system, one CACS 5 action information system, two Type 970 jammers, UAA-1 Abbbey Hill ESM, Link 11 and 14 datalinks and two SCOT satelite communication systems Propulsion: COGAD arrangement. Diesel-Electric cruise powerplant which is very quiet, has no mechanical connection to propellers and diesels are above watelrine to further reduce noise, electric drive also increases endurance and the generators drive the propellers and the electrical system. Four Paxman Valenta 12 RPA 200 CZ diesels delivering 7,000hp and two RR Spey SM1A for fast running delovering 34,000hp to two shafts. Performance: 28 kts clean fast, 20 knots electric cruise; range 8,500nm at 15 kts Complement: 12 + 146 with a maximum of 17 + 188 possible Class HMS Chatham (F90), Yarrow, commissioned April 1987 HMS Coventry (F91), Yarrow, commissioned June 1988 HMS Cornwall (F92), Cammell Laird, May 1988 HMS Campbelton (F93), Swan Hunter, Jan 1989 HMS Crystal, Yarrow (F94), Nov 1989 HMS Consort, Yarrow (F95), June 1990 HMS Chieftan (F96), Swan Hunter, Aug 1989 HMS Comet (F97), Cammell Laird, Nov 1989 HMS Contest (F98), Yarrow, Aug 1990 HMS Crusader (F99), Yarrow, May 1991 HMS Crown (F100), Swan Hunter, Oct 1990 HMS Cumberland (F101), Cammell Laird, Dec 1991
NATO Submarine Hunting Frigate Proposal 1981 Type: Frigate Primary role: ASW Secondary role: ASuW & AAW Length: 116 m Beam: 12,6 m Displacement: 3,900 t Max displ. : 4,700 Propulsion 2 shaft COGOG 2x Rolls Royce Tyne RM1C gas turbines 4,900 shp (3,700 KW each) 2x Rolls Royce Olympus TM3B gas turbines 27,500 shp (19,200 KW each) [ boost] Speed Cruise: 25 knots Max: 38+ knots Endurance: 4,500 Nm at 16 knots complement 145 – 163 Armament: - 1 x 76mm OTO Melara - 2x 375mm Bofors Depth charge Launcher - 2x mk32 SVTT [triple] - 2x dual Harpoon Anti-ship missile’s - 1x MK29 8-cell NSSM surface-to-Air Missile’s - 6x 20 mm Oerlikon dual purpose canon Aviation: - 1x Westland Lynx ASW helicopter - Landing platform for one and hangar for 2 Westland Lynx helicopters Special Features: - 1x Towed Array Sonar - 1x ''Backward Looking Sonar''
FFHN-1 Vandalia Class Type: frigate Year of commissioning: 1980 Displacement: 4500 metric tons (full load) L*B*D: 121m * 14m * 8,5m Lengthoa: 131m6 Beamoa: 15m Draft: 4m Freeboard: 4,5m Block coefficient: 0,66 Propulsion: CONAG (COmbined Nuclear And Gas) 1 x Westinghouse LWNP, generating 25000 SHP 1 x General Electric LM-2500-30 generating 21,500 SHP 4 x diesel generator Speed: cruising speed 20 kts, top speed 30 knots Range: practically unlimited at 20kts, but 1000nm 30 knots time. Patrol range limited only by crew, diesel and helicopter fuel. Complement: 200 Sensor and processing systems: radar: mk 23 TAS air search, SPS-76 surface search, heli control radar. Directors: 2 x mk 95 NSSM director. Sonar: SQS-56, SQR-19 Towed Array Electronic warfare and Decoy systems: SLQ-32(V)2, AN/SLQ-25 Nixie Arnament: vertical loading 155 mm gun with the ability to fire depth charges and sonobouys Mk 29 NSSM launch system Phalanx 2 x Mk 32 triple torpedo tubes Aircraft carried: 2 x SH-3 Sea King ASW helicopters. The ships would have most likely taken part of the place of the Spruances. (some of) the Spruances would be converted to Kidd types, as was originally planned. These ships are ideal for keeping an large area of ocean covered with relatively few ships. I designed them along the lines of the Perry class, as I had done a lot of research on those. This ship came out entirely different though, as you can see. An drawback of the propulsion system is the cost. The only way to cut cost…. Was to cut other systems then the engines. In this case: the radars. This makes the ship unable to do any other role then ASW. For the same reason I chose the perry’s sonar. Well, please comment. I certainly know this is not the best design for an ship like this, but I just wanted it to be different. And well…… I think I got that covered
Here are my final designs! Original ship, extended (and helicopter equipped) second flight and modification to original design.
Dortmund Class ASW Frigate Year of commission: 1980 Displacement: approx. 4000 tons Length: 406' (123m) Armament 2 x DCN 100 mm/55 2 x Twin Breda 40 mmL70 2 x Quad 375 mm AS rocket launchers 4 x 533 mm torpedo tubes 1 x 8 x Sea Sparrow SAM launcher Dortmund Class, Flight II Lengthened hull, larger hangar facilities. Goalkeeper, mk16 ASROC and 8 x Harpoon launchers. Improved radar & sonar systems. Dortmund Class, Goalkeeper mod.
Here you go Ace
Specifications Complement 224 Displacement Light – 3,100 tonnes Full Load – 4,185 tonnes Dimensions Length –134 metres Beam – 14.5 metres Draught- 7.3 metres Propulsion Shafts – 2 Engines – 4 x Ferguson 12V786-E Diesels Total Power – 32,500bhp Speed – 32 knots Range – 8,000nm @ 15 knots Armament Guns – 1 x FMC Mk42 127mm, 2 x 40mm Bofors SAM Launchers – 2 x Short Brothers Seacat GWS 22 Launchers ASW Launchers – 1 x Ikara Launcher Torpedos – 2 x triple Mk32 Tubes Decoys 2 x Loral Hycor SRBOC Mk36 (6 barrel) Radars Air Search/Fire Control – Lockheed AN/SPS-40D Fire Control (Gun Control) – Signal WM-28 Surface Search - 1 x Norden AN/SPS-67 Navigation - 1 x Kelvin Hughes 1006 Sonar 1 x Hughes SQS-53C (bow mounted) Aircraft 1 x Westland SK-50A ASW Helicopter
Displacement: 3200 tons full load Dimensions: 316.5 feet long, beam 47.5 feet Gun Armament: Two 20mm Oerlikon L/75AA in GAM-BO1 single mountings Missile Armament: One sextuple BAe Sea Wolf launchers Torpedo Armament: Two triple 12.75in A/S STWS-2 torpedo tube mountings (18 Stingray or Mk 46 A/S torpedoes) Aircraft: One Westland Sea King HAS.5 Electronics: One Type 967/968 air/surface search radar, one Type 1006 navigation radar, one Type 911 fire-control radar two chaff launchers, two Sea Gnat decoy launchers, one Type 2087 passive towed sonar array, one bow active/passive search and attack sonar Propulsion: CODLAG, one RR Olympus TM3B 21.000 kW and two 5500 kW diesels turning two screws. Performance: 30, 20 knots cruise; range 6000 at 15 kts Complement: Good question |
Author: | erik_t [ March 12th, 2012, 11:36 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
I'm intrigued... |
Author: | Hood [ March 13th, 2012, 10:26 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
Interesting. I already have a couple of ideas. Being a NATO type does it need to have standard NATO-available weapons and radars? Also who is the customer? Is it a multinational programme or just invidual nations in NATO? |
Author: | Thiel [ March 13th, 2012, 10:46 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
Preferably, but it's not a requirement. It's up to you who the user is. Personally I'm fiddling with an RN ship, but if you want yours to be a collaboration between several navies then that's okay as well. |
Author: | acelanceloet [ March 13th, 2012, 10:50 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
indeed. my own intake is an US (and maybe an dutch) version of a single multi-use design aka common nato frigate, but we decided to leave it all open to see as many different design ideas and variations as possible. |
Author: | ONI-Defense [ March 14th, 2012, 1:42 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
A very promising and interesting challenge. |
Author: | nighthunter [ March 14th, 2012, 4:57 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
Challenge accepted! |
Author: | Thiel [ March 14th, 2012, 9:32 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
A preliminary sketch for my design. |
Author: | heuhen [ March 14th, 2012, 5:49 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
I have many ideas but this is idea 1. a 4000 tons vessel. |
Author: | rifleman [ March 14th, 2012, 6:00 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: NATO ASW Design Challenge |
NATO ASW proposal L:148m B:16.6M D:6.4M Wt: 5,500T Speed Cruise 18 Kts Sprint 30 Kts Range: 17,600 Km Propulsion: COGOG 2x Rolls-Royce Olympus TM3B 2x Rolls-Royce Tyne RM1C Armament: 1x 127mm/54 Compact Oto-melara 4x Single 20mm Oerlikon 2x Twin 30mm BMARC GCMAO3 1x Signaal 30mm SGE-30 Goalkeeper 4x Mk32 Mod3 Torpedo tubes Mk141 RGM84 Harpoon Mk29 Sea Sparrow Radar: Signaal LW08 Signaal ZW06 Signaal STIR Signaal WM22 Sonar: Type 2008 Type 2031Z Towed array Electronics: ESSM, ECM, Chaff, Communications and navagation. Complement: 225-250 Aircraft: 1 Sea Seaking HAS or 2x Lynx HAS Designed by a consortium of Dutch, Canadian and UK companies taking on lessons learnt from operations in Persian Gulf and with the British in the Falklands. The ship design included enhanced damage control and firefighting capabilities. Is well protected for operations in NBC enviroment. Extensive use is being made of automation. The Ship is designed to operate for Prolonged periods in GIUK gap and in Canada Greenland sealanes. But also has enhanced airconditioning to allow prolonged operation in Hot enviroments like Carribbean and Persian Gulf. |
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