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citizen lambda
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 17th, 2016, 12:32 pm
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Now, in order to make the most of all the ideas thrown around yesterday, I've turned out drafts for the two resulting low-profile variants:

1) Phased array radar plates notionally rotated* 90° to lie on their broader side. The deckhouse above the bridge is widened and lengthened to house 3 radar plates and associated IFF modules. The 4th plate is housed atop the helo hangar in place of the first level of mainmast.
A small lattice mast has been built in place of the pyramid foremast to house the navigation/datalink radars, 2 of the Orekh illuminators and the preexisting comms equipment. There is also a new Garpun/Plank Shave surface-search/AShM target acquisition radar to replace the contentious Band Stand mentioned previously.

[ img ]

This configuration reduces the top-weight problem, at the price of some radar acquisition range, SER from the new mast, and potentially surface targeting capability.

*In point of fact, "rotated" probably would mean "rebuilt to a different shape". I don't know about the impact on scan rate and resolution and would appreciate any informed input on this.

2) Smaller single-function phased-array radar plates. Let's start over from the first phased-array configuration, remove the IFF modules and cut down the radar plates to fit the proportions seen on various 90s unbuilt projects such as the Project 11000. Again, a small lattice mast
is added to give some height to the navigation radars. Other than that, the new superstructure is similar to the original version posted above.

[ img ]

This version is the closest so far to what could be retrofitted to legacy Sovremenniy hulls. Next step will be looking at these MLU versions.

Note that a few common points have been updated on both drawings and should be retrofitted to the other drafts, such as new VLS covers for the Shtil and struts under the SATCOM bubbles.

How does that look compared to the previous versions?

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seeker36340
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 19th, 2016, 2:12 am
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No change in the hangersetup?


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citizen lambda
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 19th, 2016, 1:10 pm
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seeker36340 wrote:
No change in the hangersetup?
Not from my side, no. The only sensible change to the hangar is the fixed non-telescopic version of Pr.956EM.
I'm not including that in my updates because it comes at the price of one aft weapon station (turret or VLS), and the original operational concept privileges offensive weapons over helo-based operations. I am aware that this is a limitation of the design, but it would need a complete different layout supporting a real multi-role design to make it worth the bother improving helo facilities.
Or did you have something else in mind with the hangar setup?

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citizen lambda
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 21st, 2016, 9:05 pm
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Let's switch now from non-existing new-build Pr.956.2 ships back to non-canonical upgrades of legacy (and existing) Pr.956 ships.
I present two examples of possible ship evolution, purely as an example of the upgrades I have in mind, since that would be a lot of successive upgrades to pack on a few ships.
Obviously most of these upgrades are carried over from the previously discussed Pr.956U and 956.2.

Note: these configurations are examples so far and not integrated to any kind of AU setup, and will therefore be presented without much in the way of historical context.

Let's start with the Bespokoyniy, one of the last Pr.956A hulls built.
As one of the most modern units in the class, it doesn't need major upgrades in its combat capabilities, but it makes a decent field trials ship for the Oniks. It can be seen below in the mid-90s with the Moskit-M launch bins replaced with angled deck launchers for the new Oniks SSM. The launcher are an armored version of the SM-316 already tested on the Projekt 1234.7 Nakat missile boat, but in a 3x3 9-tube arrangement, for a total of 18 Oniks missiles per ship*. For reduced top-weight, the modular launchers can be cut down to 6 tubes each.
[ img ]
*This has been discussed before about the documented Pr.956U versions, and further tests (in SB scale, but still) show that no more than 3 Oniks tubes fit in the width of the Moskit launch bins.

A further upgrade of the Oniks-equipped Bespokoyniy would come much later on in the form of a mid-life upgrade. The example below depicts Bespokoyniy in the early 2010s following a major systems upgrade aiming to improve dramatically its air defense capability while keeping costs down.
No fixed phased-array radar was added, instead the legacy Fregat-M2 was replaced by a C-band Podberyozovik-ET2 radar of the next generation.
The single-rail Uragan launchers have been replaced each by two 12-cell 9S80M VLS packs for the 9M317M missile family. The more capable 3x12-cell fit of the Pr.956.2 has been rejected to reduce the amount of work on the structure. To improve the AA capabilities to a true 2010s standard, the launchers are forward-compatible with the next-generation medium-range SAM that fits the envelope of the 9M317.
To handle the new missiles and compensate the lack of a high-frequency, agile target-acquisition radar, five directional-AESA arrays have been fitted as direct replacements of two pairs of Orekh/Front Dome missile guidance antennas and the Lev/Kite Screech gun director radar.
Close-in defense has been brought twenty years forward with the removal of the AK-630 and the installation of one pair of Pantsir-K gun-missile CIWS on the aft elevated mountings developed for the Project 956U.
Target acquisition for the Pantsirs is handled by the associated double-faced PESA rotating array, placed on the reworked mainpast also based on Pr.956U.
Self-defense has also been improved by the addition of a naval version of Kvant's Kashtan-3M laser luring system, with two decoy designators sited forward of the bridge and over the hangar, supported by 4 pairs of hemispherical laser warning receivers. Two pairs of legacy Spektr-F warning receivers have been retained in central locations as backup.
In addition, the Start-1 EW suite has been replaced by hybrid setup based on the new TK-25 system, supported by the addition of four PK-12 chaff launchers.
The Oniks launchers have been retained and rewired to fire the complete Kalibr missile family in addition to the Oniks. The related improvements in fire-control systems are of course invisible from the outside.
[ img ]

Now let's look at the Boevoy, one of the first ships of the series. A first upgrade in the late 90s would also involve replacing the first-generation Moskit launchers with SM-316 9-tube launchers, although at this date this can directly be equipped to fire Kalibr missiles (note that the mission profile and sensor fit of the Pr.956 as a whole means that a large majority of the tubes would still be dedicated to Oniks AShMs.
In addition, the version presented below has been upgraded with four Palma gun-only CIWS replacing the AK-630 one-on-one for double firepower and independent RF-silent targeting without additional deck penetration.
[ img ]

A few years later, a configuration like the Boevoy above could be upgraded again with a new radar fit. The main Fregat array is replaced with the half-size Podberyozovik-ET2, supported by a Pozitiv-M1 rotating phased array to help with short-range, low-altitude target acquisition. Once more, the addition of the second radar requires rebuilding the mainmast to the version developed for the Pr.956U.
The unsatisfactory Palma CIWS has been replaced with the similar but more mature Palash, still without missiles to fit the footprint of the original AK-630.
[ img ]

Again, that's a lot of upgrades for only two ships, where they would probably be spread out more over the series. As I said, examples only.
More of these to follow for your appreciation! Enjoy!

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Last edited by citizen lambda on July 29th, 2016, 7:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

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maomatic
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 21st, 2016, 9:21 pm
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I don't know much about modern warships, but those are incredible drawings.
The detail work is simply excellent!


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erik_t
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 21st, 2016, 9:46 pm
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Excellently drawn and eminently reasonable based on what I know of modern Russian systems. I do wonder if the back-to-back PESA (and Pozitiv) would be happier in a bubble radome, since it's swimming in exhaust gas?


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adenandy
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 22nd, 2016, 12:02 am
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FANTASTIC work Citizen :!:

And very interesting narrative as well. Well done old boy, first class :D

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Hood
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 22nd, 2016, 7:44 am
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Excellent additions and they make perfect sense and its nice to see how the modern stuff fits in.

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citizen lambda
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 22nd, 2016, 8:33 am
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Thanks everyone for the positive feedback! Glad to see these are coming out well, it's taken a lot of work to ensure the upgrades were a good fit to the original design.
erik_t wrote:
I do wonder if the back-to-back PESA (and Pozitiv) would be happier in a bubble radome, since it's swimming in exhaust gas?
Obviously there would be domes for these small radars, just like you find over the Pozitiv on the Project 956EM. In this case, let's say the domes are omitted for clarity, since they would all turn out mostly the same size. I should have mentioned this in the notes.

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Tempest
Post subject: Re: Project 956 Sovremenniy destroyer: post-1990 Soviet versPosted: July 22nd, 2016, 9:47 pm
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amazing level of detail! Lovely designs.

All the best

Tempest.

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