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paul_541
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 2nd, 2011, 6:46 pm
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Gollevainen wrote:
the thing looks more reconnisable as phalanx when facing sideways...but I agree on Hood, sometimes logic can be also used. In cases where you need to make exceptions to the rules, you need to have good ground for doing so, and I think this would be on the edge for it.
OK, and for my new SPS-49 (Also, I little bit modified the SPS-10) ? :?

Greetings. ;)

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My motto:Per ardua ad astra (RCAF)
Current Drawings:
USS Midway CVB-41 and later alterations
HMCS Bonaventure CVL-22 and later alterations
Paul 2024


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erik_t
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 2nd, 2011, 6:57 pm
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I will investigate the SPS-49 issue. They're often badly drawn on non-bucket line drawings. I recall looking into it some time ago and deciding the current one was good enough, but I'll revisit the issue.


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bezobrazov
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 3rd, 2011, 3:49 am
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I'm glad that reason and sheer logic seem to prevail here! I hope paul will revert his drawing back to the original. As for the SPS-49, I believe yours (paul) is not yet quite up to the standard, but getting closer... - the one in current use is a fairly bland thingy. Since, evidently SB has gradually moved up-scale quality-wise, I see no reason why we should not reassess old versions and attempt to improve upon them! I don't think we anylonger can just settle for "good enough' when every serious artist in this community appears to be driven by an ambition to up the quality standards, even at times, to outdo one other in a noble competition!

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ALVAMA
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 5th, 2011, 5:42 pm
I quit like the drawing, it's excellent work! Can I get premission to do a USS Kentucky, BBG design?


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erik_t
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 5th, 2011, 7:40 pm
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bezobrazov wrote:
I'm glad that reason and sheer logic seem to prevail here! I hope paul will revert his drawing back to the original. As for the SPS-49, I believe yours (paul) is not yet quite up to the standard, but getting closer... - the one in current use is a fairly bland thingy. Since, evidently SB has gradually moved up-scale quality-wise, I see no reason why we should not reassess old versions and attempt to improve upon them! I don't think we anylonger can just settle for "good enough' when every serious artist in this community appears to be driven by an ambition to up the quality standards, even at times, to outdo one other in a noble competition!
Well, there are several relevant questions.

First, is the new drawing more accurate than the old one? I'm not convinced of this yet - SPS-49 is notoriously 'fluid' in size, shape etc even on professional line drawings.

Second, is the change in accuracy meaningful? If a single pixel must be moved to enhance accuracy, but 100 drawings must change, is this worthwhile? SPS-49 is used on many, many drawings.

Third, does a new and more technically accurate drawing accurately convey the nature of the entire system? Here, I will passionately argue, the new SPS-49 drawing fails. It looks very strongly like a solid-sheet reflector, when one of the defining (modern) characteristics of SPS-49 is the open mesh reflector. While an open reflector seen from the side looks very opaque in reality, it does not convey the nature of the real thing effectively.

We need to be mindful of all of these questions.


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paul_541
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 5th, 2011, 10:07 pm
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erik_t wrote:
Well, there are several relevant questions.

First, is the new drawing more accurate than the old one? I'm not convinced of this yet - SPS-49 is notoriously 'fluid' in size, shape etc even on professional line drawings.

Second, is the change in accuracy meaningful? If a single pixel must be moved to enhance accuracy, but 100 drawings must change, is this worthwhile? SPS-49 is used on many, many drawings.

Third, does a new and more technically accurate drawing accurately convey the nature of the entire system? Here, I will passionately argue, the new SPS-49 drawing fails. It looks very strongly like a solid-sheet reflector, when one of the defining (modern) characteristics of SPS-49 is the open mesh reflector. While an open reflector seen from the side looks very opaque in reality, it does not convey the nature of the real thing effectively.

We need to be mindful of all of these questions.
Yes, I understabd what do you mean...
I will modify my SPS-49 in consequence in some updates:
modify my SPS-49 in consequence in some updates:
[ img ]
ALVAMA wrote:
I quit like the drawing, it's excellent work! Can I get premissiono to do a USS Kentucky, BBG design?
Yes, you can do the USS Kentucky BBG. I'm anxious to see it... :shock: :D

If you have references and GOOD PICTURES of modern Iowa class for I can do them, I would like to see they please... ;)

Thanks in advance and greetings. ;)

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My motto:Per ardua ad astra (RCAF)
Current Drawings:
USS Midway CVB-41 and later alterations
HMCS Bonaventure CVL-22 and later alterations
Paul 2024


Last edited by paul_541 on April 7th, 2011, 12:06 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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bezobrazov
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 5th, 2011, 10:14 pm
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A most well considered response erik_t! I can fully agree with your way of reasoning. On closer inspection, bringing the object to full magnification in my paint, I did noticed the same idiosynchratic features as you're referring to. On my saved pictures of the US nuclear cruisers of the Virginia class and the Californias, I had to considerably lighten it up to reflect the fact that it was painted in the hull color and not black as is shown on the standard version provided by SB. But, I still think it can be more highly detailed to depict the complexity of the structure. But, like you said, those questions need to be heeded the correct way, and no rash decision made, and I never (hopefully) implied that! But I believe with the rather solid core of expertise we are provided with at SB we ought to resolve such an issue fairly easily!

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My Avatar:Петр Алексеевич Безобразов (Petr Alekseevich Bezobrazov), Вице-адмирал , царская ВМФ России(1845-1906) - I sign my drawings as Ari Saarinen


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Colosseum
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 6th, 2011, 7:51 pm
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Did you draw this entire thing yourself or did you use my original drawing?

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USN components, camouflage colors, & reference links (World War II only)


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moxica
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 6th, 2011, 8:41 pm
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When I see the Iowa class in that setup I emediatly starts thinking about the movie Under Siege.
All we need now is a submarine next to it and a makeshift crane off loading Tomahawks :lol:


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paul_541
Post subject: Re: USS New Jersey 1983 & Iowa classPosted: April 6th, 2011, 9:13 pm
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Colosseum wrote:
Did you draw this entire thing yourself or did you use my original drawing?
No, I didn't use parts of your old Iowa. I completly redraw with this drawing (in the pdf document) of HNSA and add details and modifications:
http://www.hnsa.org/doc/plans/bb62.pdf


Greetings. ;)

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My motto:Per ardua ad astra (RCAF)
Current Drawings:
USS Midway CVB-41 and later alterations
HMCS Bonaventure CVL-22 and later alterations
Paul 2024


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